Producers not getting respect.............

[Freakwncy]

Beep Beep...

When it comes to the rap game... producers vs. rappers, it's a two way road.....we can sell w/o rappers but how many people just listen to instrumentals, beside us(producers) and real music lovers....and how many times have I wish for a rapper to bust over one of my new beats just to get a feel for what type of flow would work with it....Its a team effort like GangStarr....they're the prefect team in my eyes...

 

[vitaminman]

Hey,

Thought I'd chime in here...

It's the same thing in the techno community, everyone thinks that techno music is made BY computers, like someone sits down, turns the gear on, hits the 'Make Club Track' button and it does the rest of the work. It bothered me to no end that people got on my case about me not 'playing' my instrumets, that I was letting the synths do the work.

You guys have brought up some interesting points:

1. For the most part, electronic musicians go light years further than traditional musicians when looking for new sounds. I'm not talking about the technical ability to whip out some crazy solo or scale runs; I mean either creating sounds from scratch or taking existing ones and messing with them until they're completely new ones.

Guitarists I think are the worst at innovation. It's still just a guitar, a mic and an amp, and it has been for the past 60 or so years. The design of the electric guitar hasn't changed much at all, people still look for that fuzzy overdriven sound that makes my ears hurt in bars.

2. Electronic musicians also have to learn about other sides of audio production, such as programming, recording, engineering, mixing, arranging, etc. And computers!!! A lot of traditional musicians are only good at performing with their instrument, they can only play with a group or with someone else's music in front of them. And how many of them even know how to use a computer?

3. Electronic musicians tend to try to push the boundaries of their gear as well as the genre of music they work in. This is why I find older hip hop so exciting; there were all sorts of new styles being created, all sorts of classic stuff being released. It seems though nowadays hip hop has taken a step backwards...

4. Electronic music is relatively new and not as accepted as a 'real' form of music because traditional music has revolved largely around the performance. There's not a whole lot of performing in hip hop, most of the time it's a couple of guys in the studio hitting away at buttons. This will change as people's ideas about music change.

5. People don't understand fully what electronic music is. Case in point, the preacher's comments about the whole 'record-player mixing thing'; he's a preacher, his job is to be God's representative on earth, not to know the in's and out's of turntables and samplers. As far as he's concerned, they're all one and the same because there aren't any pianos or guitars in it. I've tried time and time again to explain to my dad what a 'remix' is, he still doesn't get it!

My two cents,

Nick

 

[Cold Truth]

yep........... well, you hit the nail on the head right there vitaminman.......... so my next question is- what will be done to change that perception? what can be done? i think that it needs to be. i know for myself, everyones eyes grow wide when they find out that a lot of my tracks are done by myself, with the only musical knowledge i have being learned as i go by picking up on little things that i was screwing around with to begin with... then i get props. i am not perticularly LOOKING for that type of praise, but it feels good to be looked at in the same light as a guitarist, because my drum machine, my sampler, and y sound module are unique instruments that most people i know have know clue how to operate!!! any one can learn how to use these things, the same as "traditional" instruments, but it takes the same skill levels to use them in their respective ways.......

 

[vitaminman]

Hey,

Not a whole lot except time will change that. Remember when only black kids from big cities listened to rap while the white kids were all listening to metal? Now look who the hottest artist is today...

If people give you grief about it not being 'real' music, tell them that you get more satisfaction out of listening to 'fake' music and that they're probably too stupid to get it; they DESERVE their Celine Dion and Sting albums...the more they see you getting wound you up, the more they will mess with you.

And don't even put yourself in the same category as guitarists unless you spend Friday nights playing in some dive bar for $50 to help pay the bills that their Denny's job doesn't cover. There are a SQUILLION guitar players out there...

Take care,

Nick

 

[Cold Truth]

yeah thats very true......... i do know quite a few that are actually going places, in different areas.... as far as the comparison, i do not think that there is one- partially because i will learn that art at some point, and as a producer i want, and need to be (for my own personal ambitions) a man of many pieces of the music. i dont get wound up when people make refrences to the "assembly" of electronic music, but it sure does eat at me o my own time SOMETIMES.

 

[raider]

Yo, I know what you guys are saying .. it always used to bother me when people would say listen to the tracks of my group and act as if the MCs were soley responsible for the track. The way I always saw it, is the beat is what moves most people - hype lyrics with wack beats just don't get many fans, except for the most hardcore lyrical heads.

But at the same time, I don't think this is a problem that exclusively affects hip-hop and electronic music. Think for a minute .. apart from the Rock bands who write their own ish, most famous songs out there are known only by their performer. Who wrote Michael Jackson's "Bad", or "Thriller" or "Billy Jean" ... these are all ridiculously famous songs, but apart from the serious fans, who really knows who wrote these songs? I mean, anyone singer can perform the songs - the true genius is the song-writer. Don't get me wrong, there are some very famous songwriters out there (e.g. Babyface), but their numbers are limited.

The fact of the matter is, people look to the performers since they are the ones who brought the art to the audience. Who wrote the script to your favourite movie? Do you know? Maybe you do, but how many people would be able to answer that question? We might make the magic, but because we are not out there performing, we are usually confined to being behind-the-scenes. If anything, many hip-hop and electronic fans make a point of knowing the producers of their music, more so than most other forms of music. This may not be enough for some of us, but it might be something we have to live with ...